Will AI replace online coaches, or only the ones who stop being human? Veteran online coach and Men's Health author Bryan Krahn joins Dr. Mike T Nelson for a candid, unfiltered conversation about paying for expertise, whether coaches should disclose AI use, personal experiences with peptides and TRT (opinion, not advice), and Mike's simple rower-based cardio plan.
Bryan Krahn has been a personal trainer since 1997, a CSCS since 2005, and a full-time online coach since 2014. He is a fitness writer and the author of two books with Men's Health.
Will AI replace online coaches, or only the ones who stop being human? Veteran online coach and Men's Health author Bryan Krahn joins Dr. Mike T Nelson for a candid, unfiltered conversation about paying for expertise, whether coaches should disclose AI use, personal experiences with peptides and TRT (opinion, not advice), and Mike's simple rower-based cardio plan.
Expect to learn why paying for expertise makes you a better coach, how Bryan and Mike use (and distrust) AI in coaching and writing, whether coaches should disclose their AI use, why stacking compounds makes personal experiments hard to interpret, how Bryan thinks about TRT and lab markers like HDL, LDL and PSA, and Mike’s simple rower-based cardio plan—and much more.
Bryan and Mike discuss peptides, TRT and other compounds from personal experience and opinion. Nothing here is medical advice; talk to a qualified healthcare professional before changing any medication or supplement routine.
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Flex Diet Podcast Ep 409 - Bryan Krahn - Transcript
Timestamps follow the final episode audio (after the intro). Speakers: Dr. Mike T Nelson (host) and Bryan Krahn (guest).
[02:25] Dr. Mike T Nelson: It’s like the, to me in, in online training and coaching, it’s the ultimate catch-22 of when you start, if you don’t have another business- Mm-hmm … or a partner or source of income- Mm-hmm … you kinda have to take people you may not be best set up to take, because you can’t afford to not make your mortgage payment.
[02:48] Dr. Mike T Nelson: And the ironic part is, when you’re more successful, now I have the luxury of someone could call me tomorrow and unless they wanna pay me an obscene amount of money, again, everyone has their price. Yeah. Yeah. As long as I’m not doing anything unethical, I’d be like- Yeah. … I’m, I’m good, because you know that most of your time- Yeah
[03:04] Dr. Mike T Nelson: is gonna go into this person, and the result is not gonna be what it should be either. So you’re doing both of them a disservice. Yeah. But it’s nice to be in the position where you can walk away and like, “Hey, I can still make all my payments. Like, it, there’s no-
[03:16] Bryan Krahn: Yeah …
[03:17] Dr. Mike T Nelson: no harm, no foul. I’m gonna be fine.” But when you start- Mm-hmm
[03:20] Dr. Mike T Nelson: you, you just don’t have that luxury. And I’ve taken many clients on, many, many years ago, that I shouldn’t have taken on. Yes, I had the- No … the skill set to solve it, but personality-wise, we were not remotely compatible.
[03:34] Bryan Krahn: Oh, I know, I know. And, uh, yes, and I’ve been the, and I s- well, and I can u- I can usually kinda s- s- smell out the people that I’m not gonna vibe with pretty easy.
[03:44] Bryan Krahn: Yes. Um, s- you know, some still get by. Yeah. Um, uh, but yeah, and it, it tends to, I, I, I’ve rarely had one go, “You’re too much of an asshole. Quit.” You know, it happens, but very rarely. Um, but yeah- Yeah, like it’s, one thing I did right completely out of pure ignorance, but just ’cause it felt comfortable to me, it’s like I c- I’ve been doing this so long, I’ve always kinda only felt comfortable working with versions of me.
[04:15] Bryan Krahn: Mm. Yeah, yeah. But maybe a cou- maybe a couple years younger. So when I was like, what, about 40, I started going, “Well, I’m gonna work with kinda 40-year-olds.” And then when I was 45, oh, I’m the over 40 guy. And then when I turned 50, other people actually, magazines and stuff, and companies were suggesting, “You should just be the over 50 guy.”
[04:33] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah.
[04:34] Bryan Krahn: And I’m like, I’m like, this is, fuck, like, when I’m 60, I’m gonna be- You’re
[04:37] Dr. Mike T Nelson: the over, the, the geriatric AARP guy.
[04:40] Bryan Krahn: I know. And I’m like, now I go, “Oh, man, now I gotta live long enough.” Like, oh, yeah, yeah. So, uh. Um, but yeah, so I mean, but in a way, though, it’s good ’cause I live it, you know? Mm-hmm. You know, and a lot of the shit that I, problems that I solve are literally just like, like what crisis did I go through this morning?
[04:59] Bryan Krahn: Oh, it’ll probably apply to this guy. Yeah. It’ll apply to this guy. So especially with kids, man. Anything with kids. Yeah. Or, or being an older dad, like all that- Yeah. You know, I know you don’t, you don’t have, uh, kids of your own. No kids of my own- I do. No … but most of my clients- Yeah … have
[05:15] Dr. Mike T Nelson: kids.
[05:16] Bryan Krahn: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[05:16] Bryan Krahn: Yeah. And, and it’s just, um, it does, it just completely changes, uh … I know it sounds cliche, it changes the way you think and it changes- Mm-hmm … your priorities. Yeah. Um, it’s a little bit more nuanced than that. It just, it changes the amount of mental bandwidth you dedicate to things. So it’s like, you know, whereas before you’re like, “I’ll give, I’ll give 30% of my attention to this thing,” now when you got kids, “I’ll give 1% of my attention-
[05:42] Bryan Krahn: to this thing.” So, but, uh, yeah. So I’ve, I’ve been kind of h- I’ve been helped along that way by being very kind of insecure about going to … I’m not gonna help teenage girls, you know? Like- Yeah … like, what the hell am I gonna do? Be like, “Just, you know, put a shirt on. Grow up.” “Go to school.” “How ’
[06:05] Dr. Mike T Nelson: bout that guy?”
[06:05] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Stay in school, kid.
[06:07] Bryan Krahn: Sorry.
[06:09] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah. That’s, that’s also one of those weird things when you, when you start. So, like, what I … Even sometimes I’ll still do this now, I call it, like an, an edge case, and I’ll just tell them flat out up front, like, “Hey, have I worked in this exact situation before? No.” Yeah. “Do I have some things I think may help?
[06:26] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yes.” Mm-hmm. But the caveat is I’m at a position now where the only time I take those people is if I have t- at least two other legitimate experts I could call on a first name basis to, like, bail me out. Yeah. And I’ll be up front- Yeah … and just tell them. Be like- Mm … “Hey, this is kind of at the edge of my knowledge.
[06:45] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Here’s what I think we can do, but I do have the luxury- Okay … of I can call other people who can help me with this. And if you feel comfortable with that,” and again, a lot of times these are very more kind of difficult, weird, obtuse, kind of one-off type cases too, then I’ll still do it. But it, when you start, you don’t have a lot of times a big enough referral network to, to lean on.
[07:09] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Mm-hmm. Yeah. And so the thing I’ve told coaches time and time again is, and I wish someone would’ve just beat me over the head with this, is that a shocker, you can pay people for expertise. Like-
[07:19] Bryan Krahn: Oh, God.
[07:19] Dr. Mike T Nelson: You know, like I, I, if I, someone would’ve told me this when I started, I’m like, oh man, even if I broke even on a client, I had to pay for- Yeah
[07:27] Dr. Mike T Nelson: a lot of other help, and I still, you know, got them the result. I was still able to help them in an ethical way. But I, I keep all that knowledge. So the next person- I don’t need to, I don’t need to do that. Mm-hmm. You know, and even when I did some sport supplementation stuff- Mm-hmm … I, I called a buddy- Yeah
[07:43] Dr. Mike T Nelson: of mine who I know real well and said, “Hey, man, give me your, your, your couple hourly rate. I will pay you whatever your time- Yep … is worth. I wanna pay you for your time.” Mm-hmm. “I did all this stuff, but I want you to double-check everything I did, to tell me the questions- Yeah … that I didn’t ask that I should have asked.”
[07:59] Dr. Mike T Nelson: And I’m like, y- you can do that when you charge money to people.
[08:05] Bryan Krahn: Yeah. Yeah. I, um… And it’s funny that you, th- I think that is lost today because- Yes … there’s just, there’s so much, there’s so much information on the internet. You hear that? There’s so much good information on the internet now. True. And of course, so, so- A lot of shit too.
[08:20] Bryan Krahn: Yeah. W- but, you know, like if you have to know where to dig, and it takes time But funny enough, like, again, I’m so old. Like, like I am so used to paying for consults. Like I, I found a receipt, funny enough, from 1999, so I guess I was 25 or so, and I… Eh, yeah, around that. And I, and I paid Charles Poliquin, Charles Poliquin 300 bucks or 500, like at least 300 bucks US.
[08:49] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Dude, that’s a ton of money back then, especially US, not even Canadian.
[08:53] Bryan Krahn: Well, back then our fucking dollar was par, but don’t get, but um- That’s probably true. But, uh, but still, that was a lot of money for me. Yeah. Um, for I think 40, 45 minutes.
[09:03] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Mm.
[09:04] Bryan Krahn: The, and the fucker’s Canadian.
[09:09] Bryan Krahn: You know? I think, I think, I think I lived near him. I could just drove there, like- You could drove to his house. And so that was the first time, and then I, I was kind of a s- in his groups and stuff, and I would… He would always have a, a seminar, which I would attend, which weren’t cheap. Um, and then if you gave him like 500 bucks, you could take him out for lunch.
[09:29] Bryan Krahn: Yeah. You know? Because… But to his credit, as nutty as he was about, about things, and ’cause he was kind of on the spectrum, it’s kind of- It’s, it’s-
[09:38] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah …
[09:38] Bryan Krahn: it’s a weird- He was a weird kind
[09:40] Dr. Mike T Nelson: of on the spectrum.
[09:41] Bryan Krahn: Yeah, you know, now it’s kinda like, yeah, you know, now you can kinda say that ’cause, because he’s passed.
[09:47] Bryan Krahn: Yeah. Um, but everything he told me to do in those one-on-one calls, like in his classes he’d say a lot of woo. Mm-hmm. But like in those one-on-one calls, everything he told me to do, especially about building my business, was bang on.
[10:01] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Mm. Nice.
[10:03] Bryan Krahn: Yeah, like even going back 25 years. He was like, he was like, “Eh, you’re not an athletic.
[10:07] Bryan Krahn: Y’all never gonna get an Olympian.” Like, “What are you, you’re not, you’re, you know, you’re not an athlete.” And I’m like, “No, I’m not.” He’s like, he’s like, “You, you should work with normal people. You know, get jacked yourself. Solve problems. Help other people look like you.” And I was just like, “Oh, okay.” Okay. You know?
[10:25] Bryan Krahn: And it was, you know, and it’s, it, it actually, it made sense, and it kinda changed how I… I stopped trying to compete with people like you. Like I’m not a- … PhD, you know, I’m not a PhD. Uh, you know, I’m not gonna help somebody, I’m gonna shave, uh, half a second off your 40 time. Yeah. Like, fuck, like, like I don’t even know those people, so it’s like…
[10:43] Bryan Krahn: But I know lots of normal folks, you know? And, and stuff, and I know how to, whatever. Like I know the bodybuilding side of things. Mm-hmm. So it’s like, that’s, that’s kinda where I carved out what I wanna do, and it also fit my, what I personally like to do. Yeah,
[10:56] Dr. Mike T Nelson: but I think that means you can be your authentic self at the same time, and that makes all your- Yeah
[11:01] Dr. Mike T Nelson: your marketing and everything else, like, just so much easier. And especially- Yeah … now where, you know, even now as of the recording, I, I played with a, an AI video reading a study just to see. Eh, I d- I don’t like it, but I posted just to see, “Hey, give me your thoughts. Do you like this? Do you not like this?
[11:19] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Do you,” whatever. Mm-hmm. But it’s, I think being authentic is probably the biggest lever people who are even new can pull, and it’s gonna be even worth- Mm … more now than it was a couple decades ago.
[11:34] Bryan Krahn: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It’s, yeah, it’s kind of scary. Not scary, but like- D- do you remember when, like, ChatGPT first came out, and everyone got it- Yes
[11:45] Bryan Krahn: and everyone was like y- you know. And, and we d- I’m sure you did this. If not, whatever. Like, I, I would ask for a very s- kind of specific program that maybe- Mm-hmm … that I maybe, maybe, like, I would give a client. And it would give me one, and I’d look at it, it’d be terrible. Mm-hmm. I’d be like, “Hey, this, uh…
[12:00] Bryan Krahn: you know, this ain’t my competition.” And then, like, two years later, be like, “Okay, this looks all right. Oh, big mistake,” you know. “Oh, this is terrible. I found a mistake.” Mm-hmm. You know, now it’s like, you know, I run things by it, and I’m like, “Okay, this is all good.” You know? Yeah, passable. “This is perfectly passable.
[12:17] Bryan Krahn: Oh, one mistake. Oh, I wouldn’t do that. I’d have…” You know? So I think in two years from now, like, you know, you know, if… Maybe in our little niches that we know so well-
[12:28] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah …
[12:29] Bryan Krahn: you know, you know, like, if I could… It won’t, it won’t get me on bodybuilding stuff. Like, I can tell you, like, the PED stuff is fucking terrible.
[12:36] Bryan Krahn: It is way off.
[12:37] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Oh. I’m sure it’s way off. I mean, the handful of things I’ve just poked in- Yeah … just a little bit on that to see, I was like, “Oh, even I know that’s fucked.”
[12:45] Bryan Krahn: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Ex- exactly. But talk about a specific niche, you know?
[12:50] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah.
[12:50] Bryan Krahn: Um, and, and I’m sure in your world, like, uh, you know, the higher the ex phys stuff, you’re like, “Oh, that’s, that’s, that’s out of date,” you know?
[12:57] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Oh, yeah. But- There’s a lot of stuff outdated. Like, it still loves zone two, and I’ve had I don’t know how many arguments with it about it. And I’ve like, “Show me the studies.” Yeah. And then it would show- Yeah … like, a three-zone model. And I’m like, “No, five-zone model.” And then- Yeah … it’ll still give- Yeah … and it’ll be like an hour later, it’ll be like, “Oh, yeah, I guess there isn’t many adaptations there.”
[13:15] Dr. Mike T Nelson: And this is the, the AI I use that I’ve put all these studies into to, to try to- Yeah … air quote, “train it”. But it still- Yeah … reverts back to the stuff that it’s been trained on, unless you’re highly specific- Mm-hmm … and you do specific things or whatever. Yeah. Um, and even the niche stuff you mentioned, too.
[13:32] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Like, I did this the other day again. So one of my goals is to pick up the 175 pound, the Thomas Inch dumbbell, the, the cast dumbbell. Yeah. And the first time I put this in was probably, like, eight months ago, and it was the worst advice known to man. It was like, “Oh, you’ll be able to do this in four weeks.”
[13:49] Dr. Mike T Nelson: I’m like, “Four- … four weeks? What are you talking about? There’s people that never picked this thing up in their lifetime,” you know? Yeah. And so I was arguing with it, and I put in all my lifts and everything, and then it said, “Okay, well, maybe if you try really hard, eight weeks.” And I went, “Oh, this is, this is stupid.”
[14:04] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah. I did this again the other day, and it got some better info, but then I realized, I was like- Oh, this is such a, talk about niche stuff, this is such a weird niche thing that most of the info is from these super old, like, grip forums, like back 10, 15 years ago, of a lot of people putting stuff in who didn’t even do the lift, who couldn’t do it at all.
[14:27] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah. Was just like, “Hey, you should do this or do that.” Yeah. And a lot of the people I know, like my coach Adam Glass, they never put a lot of that information online, but know what to do- Yeah … and have done it, you know, hundreds of times. And so I realized, oh, the AI is just pulling with what- whatever it was trained in, so it was trained on shit info to begin with.
[14:48] Dr. Mike T Nelson: And I would imagine, like, the PEDs and all these sub-niches are the same way. Think of how many yahoos are posting- Mm-hmm … in fricking Reddit forums that it’s scraped and can’t tell the difference- … and just says, “Hey, here’s your answer.”
[15:01] Bryan Krahn: Well, I know I put through to… ’Cause I like looking at my own training.
[15:05] Bryan Krahn: I’m still a wannabe athlete, so I’m like, “I’m gonna let map my training for the year.” Like anyone gi- like anybody gives a shit, you know? And that’s, um, AI gives a shit. So I give, you know, it’s like- … so this is what I’m thinking of doing, and I’m, I’m 53 years old, you know, and I weigh 208 pounds, and, and blah, blah, blah, and I’ve been training for fucking 30, 40 years.
[15:26] Bryan Krahn: Uh, my, my TRT dose is this. And it really comes back to, like when I wanna gain, I said I’d like to gain five pounds of, of muscle this year, even at my age and training age. And it’s like, “Well, that’s very, very easy.” And it’s, it’s taking on this condescending, “You don’t need a, you don’t need testosterone for that.”
[15:46] Bryan Krahn: Like, there’s no nuance of, like- And it starts to, like, talking down to me, like, “You just need to do this.” And I’m like- Yeah,
[15:52] Dr. Mike T Nelson: yeah …
[15:53] Bryan Krahn: you know, like, and then, “And you should be able to get that in four weeks.” And I’m like…
[15:57] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Four
[15:58] Bryan Krahn: weeks. Like, thanks for the back to school message, and th- and thanks for the bullshit, you know?
[16:02] Bryan Krahn: So-
[16:02] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah, yeah Yeah. But that’s what’s so hard is that-
[16:06] Bryan Krahn: Yeah …
[16:06] Dr. Mike T Nelson: I had this discussion with, not a current client, but, uh, was on a consult. And he’s like, “Wow, you know, I put all this stuff into ChatGPT for like 90 minutes last night.” And, and I said, “Well, you realize you can just ask me.” You know? Like, you don’t need to…
[16:21] Dr. Mike T Nelson: And I would actually- Yeah … prefer it, because now I don’t have to try to- Yeah … uneducate and unlearn you on all the stuff that you got l- learned. Mm-hmm. But the hard part is if you’re, if you’re not like a subject matter expert in that area, you, you don’t know what you don’t know. Like I’ve joked this- Yeah
[16:37] Dr. Mike T Nelson: be like me going to my CPA and saying, “Hey, man, I put all my tax info into the, the ChatGPT and it told me to do this.” But I don’t- Yeah … I’m dumb enough with that stuff- Well … that I don’t, I don’t know what to ask it, and it talks so- Mm … confidently back to me, that if I didn’t- Yeah … know anything else, I’d be like, “Well, this has gotta be right,” you know?
[16:57] Dr. Mike T Nelson: But I know enough to know I don’t wanna do that and I’m just gonna pay my CPA and do whatever the hell he tells me to do.
[17:02] Bryan Krahn: Yeah. I know. It’s, um… I use it for, like I, I use Trainerize and it has an AI component. Mm-hmm. And I use it for, uh, compiling data.
[17:11] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Oh, it’s
[17:11] Bryan Krahn: great- You know? … for
[17:12] Dr. Mike T Nelson: that.
[17:12] Bryan Krahn: Yeah, yeah. Super
[17:13] Dr. Mike T Nelson: beneficial.
[17:14] Bryan Krahn: And occasionally I will write in, let it, let it coach somebody, like I’ll write its responses and it’s like, “Whoa, you’re way too fucking positive.”
[17:26] Bryan Krahn: Like, “You, you had a great week.” I’m like, “I had a shit week.” You know? You know. And I’m just… I don’t, I don’t know why it a- it adopts that, you know?
[17:35] Dr. Mike T Nelson: I think it wants to literally be liked because their whole- Yeah … business model is case use.
[17:42] Bryan Krahn: Yeah,
[17:42] Dr. Mike T Nelson: yeah. And if you piss people off, they’re just gonna go to another AI that’s gonna tell them nice flowery things.
[17:46] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah. So I literally think it’s almost like baked into them for, uh… And you’ll notice that like it wants to do the next thing, right? It’s like almost like social media where it wants to keep eyeballs on the screen. There has to be something- Yeah … that’s in the background looking at runtime, because, uh, now obviously that’s tokenized and now the more runtime you have- Yeah
[18:07] Dr. Mike T Nelson: you gotta pay more. So it has to be- Yeah … built into their model I think as a way of just getting more revenue.
[18:15] Bryan Krahn: I imagine so, but, uh, the, just the thing that I, I keep saying it scares me. I, I shouldn’t say it scares me, just it, you know, concerns me, um, is just how good it’s getting. You know- Yeah. In certain areas
[18:27] Bryan Krahn: how, how, how fast. Yeah, like how fast, and just that, um, there’ll always be the niches that I think, will there always be live coaches?
[18:35] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Mm-hmm.
[18:35] Bryan Krahn: Um, I kinda think the, the w- you know, the Instagram, like the 20-year-olds, I think they might get washed out. I don’t, I don’t know.
[18:43] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah.
[18:43] Bryan Krahn: Um, the people who, who rely a lot on, on just flash and, I don’t know, you know.
[18:48] Bryan Krahn: But, uh, yeah, it’s definitely changing things.
[18:52] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Do you think people would be… Maybe compliance is not the right word. Do you think AI could be used for accountability? Do you think someone would be accountable-
[19:05] Bryan Krahn: Yeah …
[19:05] Dr. Mike T Nelson: to a bot?
[19:08] Bryan Krahn: Yeah. I think that yes. Short answer is yes, um, especially at a low price point.
[19:15] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Mm-hmm.
[19:16] Bryan Krahn: You know, I don’t think someone’s gonna pay a decent chunk of change every month to get lectured at by their iPhone. You know, I just- Yeah. It’s like, you know, at least, uh, at least- A, I’m old. Maybe it’s just me. Yeah. Um, but, um, I think the trump card in coaching right now is still… Like, when I get…
[19:34] Bryan Krahn: I’m, obviously I’m a writer. I like to write things, and, uh- Yeah … but when I get, when I get kind of frustrated with the back and forth, I’m always like, “Okay, let’s just hop on Zoom,” you know? Mm-hmm. Or increasing clients are like, “Let’s get on Zoom,” and it’s great ’cause all of a sudden you have that connection and, and I get it.
[19:48] Bryan Krahn: There’s AI avatars. Um, but I think that’s, there’s, those are still kinda not quite there yet. Um, so that, in other words, that connection where you can actually, you know, face to face break down things, that, that’s, that’s gonna be what you pay for-
[20:05] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yes …
[20:05] Bryan Krahn: you know, with someone. So, ’cause, like, it’s not, you’re not even paying for, oh, I’m paying for his knowledge.
[20:11] Bryan Krahn: Their fucking knowledge is there, man. Yeah. Like, that’s free. You can find all the knowledge. I mean-
[20:16] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Almost too much knowledge …
[20:18] Bryan Krahn: yeah, you’re paying for, I guess, the connection, but also the wisdom, and- The right knowledge at
[20:24] Dr. Mike T Nelson: the right point …
[20:25] Bryan Krahn: and that’s where it’s getting better. Mm-hmm. So it’s gonna have that pretty soon.
[20:30] Bryan Krahn: So you’re only left is gonna be just that knowing that you’re talking to a real human, um, whatever value’s in that, you know, who presumably has been in these experiences that you’re in or, or at least coached other people and- Yeah.
[20:46] Dr. Mike T Nelson: What do you
[20:46] Bryan Krahn: think of my prediction-
[20:47] Dr. Mike T Nelson: I think it’s nice … that the industry is gonna be bimodal?
[20:52] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Meaning that there’s gonna be the bottom people who don’t really know what they’re doing, they just farm everything- Mm-hmm … out to AI. Maybe they look good on Instagram, they get, you know, 200 people they’re coaching a month, and it’s all automated, but they don’t tell anyone about it. And there’s just the perception that they know what’s going on, but the only reason they do that is because they’re behind a keyboard.
[21:15] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Versus the higher end where you’re, you’re asking a live human a question live in a presentation or on a podcast, or you have an issue and you can call them, and they’re not trying to look up everything on AI before they can give you an answer. So, you can vet that they actually as an individual- Yeah
[21:36] Dr. Mike T Nelson: know what they’re talking about. Mm-hmm. It’s not them using AI as their information source.
[21:44] Bryan Krahn: Yeah. I think, and yeah, like that’s one of the reasons like I… Before I work with a client, we meet. Mm-hmm. Like, we have a, you know, and that’s, that’s part of the reason, ’cause I know just how easy it is to present a facade.
[21:57] Bryan Krahn: Um- Oh, for
[21:58] Dr. Mike T Nelson: sure. And- It’s
[21:58] Bryan Krahn: never been easier It’s never been easier. You know? And, you know, and I just think especially when you’re dealing with, you start getting the higher dollar amounts, y- you’d think you’d wanna have that, okay, you know, you’re, now I got a real human being. Maybe for better or for worse, that’s, that’s what I prefer rather than a, an expert machine.
[22:17] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Mm-hmm.
[22:17] Bryan Krahn: Um, but yeah. I mean, I can see where like, you can s- you can see where people, like I’m not on social media as much as I used to be, but where people are, coaches are jumping in and they’re answering questions, and they don’t even have the wherewithal to make it not sound like AI.
[22:36] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Mm-hmm.
[22:37] Bryan Krahn: So, they’re trying to poach that way.
[22:39] Bryan Krahn: Like, “Oh look, this is a super h- friendly, helpful coach who jumps in all the time and answers questions that weren’t even asked to him.” Um, so I, I kinda see that. Um- For sure. Yeah. But again, everything’s getting better. Everything’s getting better. It’s gonna be impossible to tell soon, so- Yeah, I think that’s what’s hard
[22:59] Bryan Krahn: kinda like it, it, yeah. Like, I have a buddy, he’s a, he’s a screenwriter, and he’s, he’s written some things that have b- been to movies. And he’s always like, “Oh, AI, that’s, it’s, it’ll never be good. It’ll never be good. It’ll never do what I, you know, what I can do,” kind of thing. Or what him and people like him can do.
[23:15] Bryan Krahn: Mm-hmm. And I’m like, like, “I don’t know, dude.” I don’t know. It’s all your- How, how good does it have to get?
[23:20] Dr. Mike T Nelson: You know, at what
[23:21] Bryan Krahn: point- Well- …
[23:22] Dr. Mike T Nelson: is good good enough?
[23:24] Bryan Krahn: Well, especially considering the shit that makes money in theaters these days. Exactly. You know, it’s, it ain’t fucking Goodfellas, you know? Yeah. You know?
[23:34] Bryan Krahn: It’s like, come on, man. You know? You don’t need to be… Yeah. But, uh, yeah. It’s l- every landscape’s gonna change, and definitely ours is, is, for sure, changing right now. Yeah.
[23:47] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Uh, two-part question. With, first with clients, do you, do you think you should disclose when you use AI? So what I’ve been trying to do lately is, I, ’cause I do some analysis with AI with my one-on-one clients, and I’ll put, you know- Yeah
[24:03] Dr. Mike T Nelson: robo-analysis at the end, and then I’ll talk about what the interpretation was. Because the reality is, man, to look at all, like, historical HRV data, to pull biometrics, to look for, you know, coefficient of variations, to look at all this other stuff I wanna look at, it’s so much faster to use AI to that and just to tell it exactly what I want it to look at.
[24:23] Dr. Mike T Nelson: But when I ask for, “Hey, how would you coach this client?” Then the AI just seems to go completely off of the, off of the rails. So I’ve tried to separate- Yeah … okay, here’s the part that I’m writing. Here’s, you know, air quote, “me”- Yeah … because this is an online environment. And here’s the analysis I did. And yes, I did disclose I, I did use some AI in the analysis.
[24:46] Bryan Krahn: Yeah, I would disclose it, just for the simple fact that probably almost all your clients are using it anyway. Like, I’ve clients tell me- Oh, I’m sure they are. Yeah. And like, I’ve clients… At first I used to get miffed at this, but now I’m like, it’s, they tell me, “Yeah, you know, I,” they go, “I took your answers, uh, to, to my questions, and I ran them through AI.
[25:02] Bryan Krahn: And, uh, yeah, you guys were surprisingly on the same page.” I’m like, at first I was offended. I was like, “Fuck.” Because now I’m like, well, okay. Yeah, all right. But, um, but yeah. So I think, I think it, it’s, you know how it is. It’s kinda like academia, man. You’re never, they’re, you’re never gonna get faulted for giving credit, so.
[25:23] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah. Yeah, so- And I just don’t want there to be any sort of- weirdness
[25:29] Bryan Krahn: of- I know you’re… Yeah …
[25:30] Dr. Mike T Nelson: people that are like, “Oh my God, I got catfished. I’ve been talking to a bot this whole time.” You know? Those sort of weird scenarios.
[25:37] Bryan Krahn: Yeah. Yeah, well, you know, assuming they got a handful of brain cells, they’ll, they’ll-
[25:42] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah, yeah
[25:42] Bryan Krahn: well, yeah, but you know, I think everybody does… That’s where I think AI shines, man, is whatever does it for those kind of comparative things.
[25:51] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Mm-hmm.
[25:52] Bryan Krahn: Like, I’ve, I have an old TV and I wanted to get a soundbar for it, you know, but I can’t just go out and buy one ’cause it’s an old TV, so I’m like, since 2015- Is it black and white?
[26:02] Bryan Krahn: So that’s fucking old. You know? It’s like, yeah. Yeah. It’s from 2015, and I think I probably paid probably 100 grand. Oh, that’s
[26:08] Dr. Mike T Nelson: not that bad.
[26:10] Bryan Krahn: Ah. It’s probably- I think it’s the same year as
[26:11] Dr. Mike T Nelson: mine.
[26:13] Bryan Krahn: It’s probably, I pro- I, like I paid, yeah, I paid thousands of dollars for it. Probably could get it for 40 bucks now, you know?
[26:20] Bryan Krahn: But anyway, I wanted to get a soundbar for it, and I’m like, “Will this work for this?” And I, and then of course when I’m like y- find it, find one that’s comparable to this one, and find one- Mm-hmm … that I’m like, as I… And find one locally, ideally on sale, and all this. And I’m like, and it goes through all the stores, and it checks with Amazon.
[26:36] Bryan Krahn: It’s a lot of shit. I mean, like, that’s where it’s awesome, you know?
[26:39] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yes.
[26:40] Bryan Krahn: You know? But-
[26:42] Dr. Mike T Nelson: And surprisingly good with photos. Like, I’ve been using AI for more just random photo stuff. Like, I had to replace the fire pot on my Traeger grill, so I’m just taking- Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah … a picture of it going, hey, what do I need to do?
[26:54] Dr. Mike T Nelson: This thing’s not doing this. And then it’s like, oh, well, you know, take this part, this part out, and then as I’m replacing it, you know, I’m just literally there poking and sending photos of me with the grill half apart, like into AI and telling me- Yeah … what to do. It’s- It was surpri- Oh, it’s awesome. The order- Yeah
[27:09] Dr. Mike T Nelson: was horrible. If I had to do it again, I could have saved myself an hour and a half because the order was wrong. But it, it worked and was surprisingly helpful with the, the pictures, which is wild.
[27:21] Bryan Krahn: Yeah, and like, and bringing it back to my industry, it’s, it, it, you know, it’s… Or our industry, excuse me. Mm-hmm.
[27:28] Bryan Krahn: Um, you know, it’s, it’s, it’s funny what triggers coaches, ’cause, um, you know, you ask, like, you know, should we say that we’re using AI for things? Yeah. And I think it’s, you know, I don’t… I think it’s fine, because everyone’s kinda doing it. And I- my answer would probably be in line with most coaches. Like, yeah, it’s probably fine.
[27:44] Bryan Krahn: We’re all doing it. But now, like, I’m in some bodybuilding groups, and they’re like, people are posting co- or coaches are asking AI based on up- like, update photos, like, what they should do next. Oh. So you have your client… Say you have your client at, like, eight weeks out, and you have your client at s- at six weeks out, you’re, or, or something.
[28:02] Bryan Krahn: You’re like, “What should I do? How should I change their program?” And instead of having the, the coaching chops to say, “Okay, we’re gonna increase your cardio. We’re gonna-” Mm-hmm … “cycle your carb,” whatever, you know? And now that’s this big kerfuffle. People are like, “That’s-” Oh,
[28:14] Dr. Mike T Nelson: really? ”
[28:14] Bryan Krahn: Oh, that’s crossing the line, man.”
[28:17] Bryan Krahn: Like, “That’s no way, man. That’s, you don’t do that.” And, and meanwhile, I’m like, yeah, you probably shouldn’t, but I would, I would, if I was prepping people, I’d still probably like, “Yeah, let’s, let’s see what he says, or AI says.”
[28:30] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah. You know?
[28:31] Bryan Krahn: That,
[28:31] Dr. Mike T Nelson: that, that made me think about… So with clients I have for physique clients- Mm-hmm
[28:36] Dr. Mike T Nelson: when they get really close to their show- Mm … I, I usually have other people that I send their photos to. Yep. Not because I, I- Yep … one, I don’t look at a ton of those photos to- Mm-hmm … look for every infinitesimal detail. And then two- Yeah … I know exactly how much- Mm-hmm … blood, sweat, and tears all these people put into it, and I know I’m just…
[28:57] Dr. Mike T Nelson: When it gets down to the end, I’m not gonna be as accurate, because I don’t wanna say anything that could be construed as bad, even though they’re paying me for their criticism. Yeah. Yeah. Like, I don’t feel like I can be a, a non-partial person. Or if it’s somebody else, and they’re in the industry, and it’s not their client, they can be like, “Oh, yeah, look at this, this, this, and this.”
[29:15] Dr. Mike T Nelson: And then I’ll send back, you know, “Coach one says this.” Yeah. “Coach two says this.” And if they’re in agreement, I’m like, okay, they’re… W- w- I’m just gonna go with that, right?
[29:25] Bryan Krahn: Almost every coach, es- especially in that world, that I know, like myself included when I’ve prepped- We all go to our friends and go, “Okay, what would you do with this?”
[29:34] Bryan Krahn: Not ’cause we don’t fucking know, but it’s just like you, you’re so… You don’t… You’re so into this person for the last 12 weeks, you’re like- Oh,
[29:40] Dr. Mike T Nelson: for sure …
[29:41] Bryan Krahn: you know, it’s just like- And you don’t wanna make a mistake either ’
[29:43] Dr. Mike T Nelson: cause you
[29:43] Bryan Krahn: know- Well, of course not … how much effort
[29:44] Dr. Mike T Nelson: they put into
[29:45] Bryan Krahn: it. Yeah, of course.
[29:46] Bryan Krahn: It’s, it’s all for the client’s benefit. It’s not, you know- Yeah, yeah … so you ask your, so you ask your, your buddy who also does this for a job, and you’re like, “What would you do here?” ’Cause I was thinking, and sometimes you, you miss things. You’re like, yeah. Yeah, you know. I think that’s good. I mean, that’s ’cause it’s all for the benefit of the client.
[30:02] Bryan Krahn: So now is asking AI any different? Well, considering how shitty the responses have been- I don’t
[30:07] Dr. Mike T Nelson: know. I don’t trust the response- …
[30:08] Bryan Krahn: is the problem. You know, you know. But, you know, you know, so it’ll get better I’m sure.
[30:16] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah.
[30:17] Bryan Krahn: So.
[30:17] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah. And I’ve even, you know, had another client who… She had done a couple shows back to back, and she, you know, wanted the Orton, so she got her pro card, natural pro card, which was great.
[30:27] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Oh, good
[30:27] Bryan Krahn: for her.
[30:27] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah. And I was like, “That’s awesome.” So we got the goal, and then she’s like, “Well, I wanna do my first pro show,” and it’s, you know, it was like six or eight weeks after her other show. Mm. And I was like, “Ah, shit. That’s a horrible time.” ’Cause like- That is a horrible time … you can’t- Yeah … come out of a deficit entirely.
[30:43] Dr. Mike T Nelson: You have to stay relatively lean, but it’s not like a week- Yeah … or two away. And so I paid a buddy of mine in Australia- Yeah … for a consult. I was like, “Hey, here’s my plan. Here’s what we’re gonna do.” Yeah. And then I got so worried the week of, I hired another guy who was a buddy of mine and said, “Hey, man.
[30:58] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Give me a number. I will pay you for your time for a week. All I want is that if I text or call you, could you get back to me in a couple hours?” He’s like- Yeah … “Yeah.” Gave me his rate, and I’m like, “Great.” Yeah. “Done. Here’s your money.” I think I called him twice, right? Yeah. But it was just having that security blanket of if I need someone, I have someone there who can answer my question, who I trust, who will get back to me in a timely manner.
[31:24] Bryan Krahn: Yeah.
[31:24] Dr. Mike T Nelson: And again, I think it’s, you know-
[31:27] Bryan Krahn: Yeah …
[31:27] Dr. Mike T Nelson: paying other people- You go- … to do stuff like that, it just- Yeah … and I slept a lot better knowing that, okay, if shit really hits the fan, I know 100%- Yeah … we will figure it out.
[31:37] Bryan Krahn: Oh, absolutely. Absolutely. And, and peaking people is hard. I mean, so, I
[31:41] Dr. Mike T Nelson: mean, that’s- Too many variables, especially when it’s her third show in like six months and you’re just like, oh, God.
[31:46] Dr. Mike T Nelson: You think of accumulated- Yeah … stress and I always like catastrophize all the worst things that could go wrong and she did great.
[31:53] Bryan Krahn: Well, yeah. I mean, there’s a little bit of- Yeah, there’s a little bit of that in, in all this, ’cause we kind of like, you know, we kinda like overdr- dramaticize, like, the last weeks of prep.
[32:05] Bryan Krahn: It’s like- Yeah … you know, basically if you- Don’t all road up … you screw it up, i- if you get all the fat off, you’re gonna, you know, all the fat. You know, if you get- Mm-hmm … all the fat off, all the water manipulation and salt and all this shit, it’s not gonna make a hell of a difference, you know? Um, but it, it is really, I respect the hell out, ’cause it is really cool.
[32:25] Bryan Krahn: It i- like, you know, especially when you, when, when you put the chemicals in the mix, it’s, it’s really cool, man. Like Oh, that’s just another level. I’m like, uh, I… It’s, yeah, like y- you know, it’s just, you know, lots can go wrong. Lots can go wrong and, and lots can go right. And now it’s like, um, like they were always so, people are so marveled by Phil Heath because he’d have to peak for, for two days So he had, ’cause the, the, the expo or the, or the contest- Mm
[32:50] Bryan Krahn: the Olympic contest were two days. You have the expo, and he’d have to… Or they have the one day show, then the next day show. Yep. As opposed to a morning and a night. And so he’d have to be, like, on for, like, 48 hours when … So that changed the game completely, and he’d always… You know, he’s won seven or eight times.
[33:07] Bryan Krahn: Seven times. So that’s, um, it’s cool. In other words, I don’t, I don’t do that level, at that level obviously. So, but the people I do- Yeah … yeah.
[33:17] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah, it’s just another level. I mean, I worked with a handful of usually older female physique clients, and that’s been-
[33:23] Bryan Krahn: Yeah, yeah …
[33:24] Dr. Mike T Nelson: super fun. And then I’ve only worked with a couple enhanced athletes in, not for probably a couple years, and the last one who was very competitive.
[33:33] Dr. Mike T Nelson: I, I was like, “You know, I, I’m not the PED expert. Do the exact same thing you did before.” And luckily John Meadows- … was alive then, so I’m like, “Let’s talk to John.” I’m failing. Like, I, this, this question- Yeah, yeah … is way outside of my league.
[33:49] Bryan Krahn: And quite hon- quite honestly, the answer you gave him is probably the best answer.
[33:53] Bryan Krahn: Like, just keep doing what works, guy. There’s no magic.
[33:56] Dr. Mike T Nelson: No, and that’s what I said. Just- Just do
[33:57] Bryan Krahn: it with-
[33:58] Dr. Mike T Nelson: I, I can’t answer your questions on this, but you’ve done multiple shows before. Yeah. Let’s just do the same thing you did before. It was nothing crazy. I know what you’re doing. Great. Yeah. I am not the one to be like, “Oh, change this by five milligrams,” or, “This by…”
[34:11] Dr. Mike T Nelson: I, I don’t know. That is just not me. That’s not the reason you hired me. We’ll find someone else- Yeah … if that-
[34:16] Bryan Krahn: Yeah …
[34:17] Dr. Mike T Nelson: comes to that point, but yeah.
[34:20] Bryan Krahn: Well, yeah. And, and, and again, that’s the PED world, but even, like, the peptide world. Like, they’re just-
[34:25] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Oh.
[34:27] Bryan Krahn: I mean, yeah, it’s, you know-
[34:29] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Do you get the affiliate offers, like, every day?
[34:31] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah. Like, every time I open my email or Instagram- Oh, yeah. I’m like- … I get some peptide offer- Yeah … from somebody who wants me to be an affiliate and- Yeah … sling God knows what from where.
[34:43] Bryan Krahn: I know. Like, well, yeah, I think I have, I have some codes. I haven’t used them in a while. You know? My thing is, like, I, I personally am in, I’m in favor doing what, of people doing what they want with their bodies.
[34:54] Bryan Krahn: Oh, for sure. Um, you know, but my big thing is when you’re taking so many at once, ’cause everybody I know… You know, I’ve tried pretty much everything, but I’m reasonably smart enough to try things one at a time. Mm-hmm. You know? When you start throwing fi- there’s, there’s, there’s limited data already, but there’s zero data on five peptides at once.
[35:15] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah.
[35:16] Bryan Krahn: You know? Or s- You know. So I mean, now you’re really in a crapshoot, you know? And, and some of them will… Well, I shouldn’t say this. Like, like, they’re, they’re not benign by any stretch. Like, you can hurt yourself.
[35:28] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Oh, for sure. Like,
[35:29] Bryan Krahn: there’s- Like- …
[35:30] Dr. Mike T Nelson: definitely risk that’s involved- Yeah … even with legitimate
[35:32] Bryan Krahn: peptides.
[35:33] Bryan Krahn: Yeah. Oh, yeah. Like, yeah. I know I experimented with, with, with Retta in my last diet- And I was- How’d it go? Oh, terribly. Oh, really? Terribly. Oh, yeah, because I just, you know, I’m pretty fit, and I don’t get whatever, you know? And I’m, and I’m like, okay, I’m gonna take a… I see everybody online, these obese people, and even- And you stay pretty
[35:53] Dr. Mike T Nelson: lean year round.
[35:54] Bryan Krahn: Well, and that’s where I’m going here. So I’m like, this probably isn’t meant for me, you know? But, you know, I got bodybuilding friends who are like, “Yeah, it just kills my appetite, man. I- that’s the only drug I take dieting now ’cause I just don’t eat, and I get…” Hmm. I’m like, I’m like, “Wow, that sounds healthy.”
[36:09] Bryan Krahn: Um. You know, like, wow, that’s just, that’s it? That’s, you know, like no stimulants, nothing? Nothing, you know?
[36:15] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Hmm.
[36:16] Bryan Krahn: So I took a, a really low dose. I did .5.
[36:19] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Hmm.
[36:19] Bryan Krahn: And I couldn’t get off the couch for three days.
[36:22] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Wow.
[36:23] Bryan Krahn: I had no energy. And if… And that, to me, I can suffer through anything, but, like, I got a kid, I’m busy.
[36:29] Bryan Krahn: Like, no energy- Yeah, yeah … I can’t… You know? Oof. That, to me, that’s the, that’s- That’s the worst. Yeah. I’d rather be throwing up, shit in my pants. Kidding. Well, but the, then I fucking- That’s what you’ve got the phones for. Like, yeah, exactly. Like, I just… And so I let it wash out. Then about a month later, I had to, I wanted to get lean again, and I was like, okay, I’m gonna try it.
[36:50] Bryan Krahn: I’m gonna go to point, I think I did .25. And, and a very similar, not as dramatic, but I was just like, just very diminished energy. Hmm. I’m just like… So I’m like, this isn’t worth it to me.
[37:02] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah.
[37:02] Bryan Krahn: And, and I’m told by, like, oh, it affects, like, the pancreas breaking down glucose, so that was, that’s, that’s what’s happening.
[37:09] Bryan Krahn: And… But my point being is is, like, it’s, yeah, it’s, it’s not a b- it’s not a benign, benign drug by or pep- whatever. Is it a drug, Retta? Yeah, it is a drug.
[37:19] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah, it’s a drug, but it’s a peptide, right, so it’s still
[37:21] Bryan Krahn: patented.
[37:22] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah. And it’s debatable if it’s- Yeah … the delivery mechanism or the actual molecule- Mm-hmm
[37:26] Dr. Mike T Nelson: and all that kind of stuff.
[37:27] Bryan Krahn: Yeah.
[37:28] Dr. Mike T Nelson: But every- Yeah, so- … other people say the same thing, that, you know, now as you get more people using these different drugs, that they’re like, they’re just overall- Sense of drive or even, like, hedonic system, for lack of a better word, just feels- Yeah … muted. Yeah. Right? And that the- Yeah
[37:45] Dr. Mike T Nelson: and most of you I’ve heard, again, this is anecdotal, who have said this to me are, what I would say are already in pretty good physical shape, are, you know, not- Yeah … that far overweight. Yeah. It’s not… Again, this is completely anecdotal. Ex- So- But there’s a
[37:59] Bryan Krahn: lot of, there’s a lot of
[38:00] Dr. Mike T Nelson: anecdotes like that But there’s a lot more that are saying that now because leaner and leaner- Yeah
[38:03] Dr. Mike T Nelson: people are using it, and especially in the physique world. Yep. You’re starting to hear this more and more often now, at least what I’ve heard.
[38:10] Bryan Krahn: That’s totally, and you know, I’m still pretty much in the bodybuilding world and because they’re always, God bless them, man, they’re fearless. They’ll try, you know.
[38:19] Bryan Krahn: And the guys who are on it, like in-shape guys who are taking it in the off-seasons ’cause they can, they saw it as a hack. Yeah. You know, “Oh, I, now I can kinda… I, I won’t use it dieting ’cause it zaps my energy, but I’ll use it off-season so I don’t get fat.” Mm. You know, “’Cause it’s gonna improve my insulin,” yada, yada.
[38:33] Bryan Krahn: They, it’s, no one’s really doing that anymore already ’cause it’s just- Yeah … they’re not, they’re not getting the pumps. Like it’s just, it’s, you know, they don’t feel good. Um, and I’m sure there’s others who are doing just fine on it, but- Oh, for sure … they’re all, yeah, they’re all kind of, also it’s, it’s screwing up carb ups when used incorrectly.
[38:53] Bryan Krahn: Of course it
[38:53] Dr. Mike T Nelson: will. Look at the-
[38:54] Bryan Krahn: Yeah. … mechanisms
[38:55] Dr. Mike T Nelson: of the drug. Shocker.
[38:59] Bryan Krahn: Well, you know. But it’s just, I don’t know, but and yeah, that’s, some were even reporting like, “Yeah, it just didn’t make me feel as happy,” you know. And this is years ago. And- Mm-hmm … it’s kinda another classic example of like bodybuilders are at the frontier, man.
[39:17] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Oh,
[39:17] Bryan Krahn: yeah. They’re fi- they’re figuring stuff out, you know, and it’s- Yeah, it’s like the- … they’re wrong sometimes. …
[39:22] Dr. Mike T Nelson: the, the pet rat brute force method.
[39:25] Bryan Krahn: Yeah. So we need them. We need them, you know? So I, that’s, I’ve always admired that. But, uh, yeah, I mean, it, to me it was just like there’s so many- I don’t know.
[39:37] Bryan Krahn: Like they always talk about how he’s… It’s, it’s a pharma- you know, it’s safer, you know? It’s like this is the… I think the only bodybuilding drug that’s stronger than that, like, it’s stronger than ephedrine to me. Like, that it would be, what is it, D- next to DNP. Like, that’s probably- DNP, oh,
[39:52] Dr. Mike T Nelson: God …
[39:53] Bryan Krahn: you
[39:54] Dr. Mike T Nelson: know? The therapeutic window is so tiny, like, you miscalculate the wrong weight, you cook yourself from the inside out, and- Oh, yeah
[40:01] Dr. Mike T Nelson: God knows where you got it from. I don’t think the chemist you got it from may not be that careful either. So who knows what you even have, what purity it is.
[40:09] Bryan Krahn: A guy I kind of remind kind of admire ’cause he’s old like me, listen to his… I won’t say his name, but- Yeah … I’ve listened to his pod- podcast, and he’s like, does this whole hell fire thing on DNPs.
[40:20] Bryan Krahn: Like, “You know, I was behind in my prep.” Uh-oh. “And the only thing… The only card I had left was…” He goes, “The only card I had left was DNP.” He goes, “I just did a…” And it went, it went so… And it went so wrong, like he got rushed to the hosp- his wife- Oh … his wife had to drag him to the hospital, and he’s full of fluid, and they were like, basically at like, “This guy’s gonna die,” and they wrapped him in ice.
[40:40] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yep.
[40:40] Bryan Krahn: Yeah. And he got out, and it was like a horror story where we’re all like, “Thank God he lived.” And then he’s like, “So the se- next time I tried it-”
[40:47] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Oh, God.
[40:50] Bryan Krahn: I’m like, “Yeah.”
[40:55] Bryan Krahn: Um, not, not, not for me. Not for me.
[40:58] Dr. Mike T Nelson: No. And everyone I know who’s, who’s tried it, our buddy Luke Lehman has tried it, and he’s said this in public, so I’m not saying anything that he hasn’t said in public. Oh,
[41:05] Bryan Krahn: fuck yeah to Luke, yeah.
[41:06] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah, I love Luke. He’s so f- Yeah, he’s- He’s so fun. But he’s like, “Yeah, I tried it.
[41:11] Dr. Mike T Nelson: I got pretty lean.” “Killed my appetite. Felt like shit.” He’s like, “I sweat yellow fluid and stained everything.” I was like, “This sounds like a horrible idea.”
[41:22] Bryan Krahn: Well, oh, one of my favorite DNP stories was years ago when Broardi was still, Broardi was still, like, into the mix- Mm-hmm … and he was doing presentations.
[41:32] Bryan Krahn: He was on, um, like, a Toronto morning TV kind of breakfast show. Mm. You know, where moms with their kids and- Yeah … and, and they go, “Now we have our health segment.” And, uh, you could call in at the time and ask Dr. John Broardi nutrition questions. And, and the, the first question was like, like, “What do I give my kids for breakfast?”
[41:52] Bryan Krahn: And he gives his, you know, typical, very polished-
[41:54] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Mm-hmm …
[41:54] Bryan Krahn: Dr., Dr. John answer. And the second question was, “How do I know if I should use DNP?”
[42:01] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Someone asked that on the air? It
[42:05] Bryan Krahn: was, it was beautiful. No. I’m just laughing my ass off. And he’s like, “DNP, that’s a mitochondrial uncoupler. No, no.” Yeah. “You don’t wanna use it.”
[42:17] Bryan Krahn: It was beaut- he handled it like a pro though, man, so.
[42:20] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Oh yeah, he probably was like, “Well, you know…” Yeah, actually- Good Canadian answer.
[42:27] Bryan Krahn: Yeah. Fuck, it was probably a friend of mine who did that, actually.
[42:33] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Have you used, like, to a lesser degree, like the BAM15, the supposedly more, air quote, “safer” mitochondrial uncouplers? I know the mechanism isn’t exactly- Yeah … the same and, and that type of thing, but.
[42:45] Bryan Krahn: Well, no, in my, I, I, in my sec, before my second re experiment-
[42:50] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Oh.
[42:53] Bryan Krahn: When I went to the Lourdes, I ran MOTS-C.
[42:55] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Okay.
[42:56] Bryan Krahn: Um-
[42:56] Dr. Mike T Nelson: How was that?
[42:57] Bryan Krahn: Didn’t get anything out of it, really.
[42:58] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah. I’ve heard mixed reviews. But I’m- Like, some people really love it, and other people are like, “Nah.”
[43:03] Bryan Krahn: And then of course I mention that and I get hammered by my, my bro friends. They’re like, “No, you gotta run SS-31 first.”
[43:09] Dr. Mike T Nelson: And I- Yeah, why? Because SS-31 is a- I, yeah
[43:12] Dr. Mike T Nelson: a cardiolipin stabilizer, but there’s no data to show that athletes have cardiolipin that’s- Yeah … off. Yeah. I mean, it’s for Barth syndrome, where they literally have a cardiolipin issue. And then the doses are higher, and it’s for multiple months at a time. Anyway, so I d- I derailed you.
[43:29] Bryan Krahn: Yeah, you know, that hasn’t cleared the border yet anyway.
[43:32] Bryan Krahn: I’m still waiting on it.
[43:34] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Well, SS-31 is an FDA approved drug, so.
[43:37] Bryan Krahn: Oh, is it? Yes. Or is it not? It is. Okay, well-
[43:39] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah …
[43:40] Bryan Krahn: oh, okay. Um, yeah. But no, I’m just… If I don’t know what is… I’m kinda like- Yeah. If I don’t really, if I don’t really know that something… Like, I know Retta works.
[43:52] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Oh,
[43:52] Bryan Krahn: for sure. I, I, I d- Yeah, there’s data on that, yeah.
[43:55] Bryan Krahn: Well, and I, and just my personal guinea pig, m- me the rat. Like, I know- Yeah … it works. And I know, and I know it’s not to be effed with. It’s not to be trifled with, you know? Yeah. So it ain’t no MOD-C to me. Like, I knew it was working. It just is, you know, it’s not, it’s for someone who’s a lot he- presumably a lot heavier, you know?
[44:11] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Mm-hmm.
[44:12] Bryan Krahn: Um, but yeah, I didn’t have that with MOD-C. I just didn’t really feel anything. Um, so yeah, when a client asks me about it, I’m just like, “Yeah, I tried it. I, I can’t vouch for it.”
[44:23] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah.
[44:24] Bryan Krahn: You
[44:24] Dr. Mike T Nelson: know. Yeah. And that, I got so much shit for this, but I was like, “Okay, all you peptide people are doing every peptide under the sun.”
[44:30] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah. I’ll take a case study before and after. Somebody, if it’s MOD-C- Mm-hmm … SS 31, mitochondrial things, whatever, cool. It should enhance your aerobic capacity. So give me a pre-test. You can pick whatever test you want. Doesn’t have to be a valid VO2 max test, like a 2K on a rower or whatever. Yeah. Give me something before.
[44:51] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Only run the one peptide. Leave your diet, everything else the same. Yeah. Yes, by all means do aerobic training. Great, fine. Give me a post. And everyone’s like… I couldn’t get anything from anyone. The only thing I got was anecdotal stuff, which is fine. Yeah. And then some people were like, “Oh, man, I know this really worked.”
[45:10] Dr. Mike T Nelson: I was like, “Cool.”
[45:10] Bryan Krahn: Yeah.
[45:11] Dr. Mike T Nelson: But they were using TRT and Clen and, like, five other compounds at the same time. Yeah. Yeah. And I’m like, h- I said, “No offense, but, like, you do you. Do whatever you wanna do.”
[45:21] Bryan Krahn: Yeah. ”
[45:21] Dr. Mike T Nelson: But how would you know, when you added this one-” Yeah. “Oh, oh, well, I k- I know my body, man. I, I can, I can tell the difference.”
[45:27] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah. And I’m like, “Maybe.” Yeah, it’s But just, I, I can’t… There’s so many other variables now in the mix. It’s, it’s so hard to determine what even happened on an NO1.
[45:38] Bryan Krahn: Yeah, it’s impossible. And it doesn’t mean that that person can’t fart around and try. Oh, no. Correct. Yeah, but- Correct … but yeah, or even give his, pass along his anecdote, but he’s always gotta be thinking, “Yeah, this is, this is me.”
[45:51] Bryan Krahn: Right. “I’m doing all this…” Yeah, you know. And that’s, yeah, that’s kinda the problem. I mean, like e- like, it’s interesting, like the, like the, the data on NAD+. Yeah. Or AD or AD or is it plus or… And yeah, and it’s, like when I’ve taken it- I think I felt it. Mm. I think I felt, you know, both injectable and, uh, and the, and the, the pills.
[46:16] Bryan Krahn: But again, like, you know, I, I, I can’t… You know, you’ll never see me really pushing it, ’cause I can’t… For me, I can’t say for sure, “Oh yeah, this, this really felt good.” Yeah. “I really noticed this.” I’ve mentioned it, like, in fucking emails and stuff occasionally, but I, I would never say, “This works. This guarantee works.”
[46:32] Bryan Krahn: I think it does, but then you get all this data saying it doesn’t, and so I don’t know. I don’t know. Yeah. Like, the data, like, like, data’s not the… I don’t know. It’s not the, it’s not the hard wall. Like, there’s, there’s, there’s still- But it’s
[46:45] Dr. Mike T Nelson: something to, to go off of because-
[46:47] Bryan Krahn: Yeah, yeah … you know,
[46:49] Dr. Mike T Nelson: like with NAD, you know, I may have tried the Tru Niagen one at two grams a day- Yeah
[46:54] Dr. Mike T Nelson: for two months off of bottles I may have procured off of their table at night when it wasn’t guarded per se. Yeah. Yeah, I was getting them. Yeah. ’Cause it was ungodly expensive at the time. And I couldn’t notice any difference. No. I did all the pre-testing, aerobic stuff. Yeah. HRV. Like, I-
[47:13] Bryan Krahn: Yeah
[47:14] Dr. Mike T Nelson: I, I did personally, I couldn’t notice any difference at all.
[47:19] Dr. Mike T Nelson: And I’m like, if it is that good, again, it might work for pathologies, ’cause that’s a completely different thing, and they do have- Yeah, yeah. You know, Chromadex does have some good data on that. Mm-hmm. But I’m like, in healthy people, if it is increasing energy production, should that not be an ergogenic?
[47:34] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Should not- Yeah … when we stress the system with exercise, we should then see a performance increase, which I don’t know, I don’t really see that. Again, pathologies aside, so I don’t know.
[47:45] Bryan Krahn: Yeah. Yeah. No, I agree. I agree. I did find, um, injections, I did feel it. I did feel something. Like, when… I know that’s the ultimate in like- Yeah, yeah
[47:55] Bryan Krahn: the supplement world. They’re always looking for supplements you can feel. Of course. That’s why, you know, that’s why pre-workouts were the shit, man. Beta alanine. Beta alanine, cr- creatine. Oh my God, you know, that was the- Yeah … you know, ra- you know, so that’s always, they’re always looking for the next supplement they can feel, and- Mm-hmm
[48:11] Bryan Krahn: I did, I did feel the injections. Like, you just… But I don’t know if it’s more, is it stimulation? So like, what is that, you know, you’re feeling stimulated. Yeah. Okay, great, but yeah.
[48:22] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah. Even with the IVs, like, I’ve had a cou- couple calls with people now, and I’m like, “You know man, like out of all the stuff you could do, I mean, if you’ve got millions of dollars to spend, great.
[48:33] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Go for it, I don’t care. But you’re telling me that you can’t afford to pay me to coach you, which is why we’re doing a one-off consult call, so that tells me you don’t have an unlimited amount of, of money.” Yeah. “And I would do aerobic testing.” I gave him a list of like seven things to do before that. I said, “I’m not saying don’t do it, I’m just saying for a bang on your return, I haven’t seen, other than maybe concussion TBI, a big payoff.”
[49:00] Dr. Mike T Nelson: And didn’t hear anything from the guy, and this has happened on a couple calls. It wasn’t just one guy. He calls back three months later. “Yeah, I did the IV thing. Felt great for two days, and I didn’t feel anything.” So, and I couldn’t resist, I said, “How much did that cost you?” $2,300. I was like, oh my God. Oh, man.
[49:18] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah. I’m just like, ah, again. Yeah. You do you, do whatever you want, but it just… And I get it, it’s a, it’s a big shiny thing. You feel it, you feel the, especially with the IV push- Yeah … I’ve heard it feels pretty painful. Yeah. And, you know, if you’re paying money, there’s, there’s skin in the game. There’s an expectation of a placebo.
[49:37] Dr. Mike T Nelson: It’s just hard to sort out.
[49:38] Bryan Krahn: Mm-hmm. And just kinda like what we harped on earlier, like what we were talking about earlier, is having- We have, it’s, like, I just think of things like in the, in the TRT space, like I know it’s much better, especially as you get older, just to get, get, kind of get yourself dialed in and then don’t change anything.
[49:57] Bryan Krahn: You know? Unless, unless, unless, you know, there’s a, there’s a reason to.
[50:00] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Unless you need to. Yeah, yeah.
[50:02] Bryan Krahn: Yeah. Like, you know, changing up doses and throwing in ancillary drugs and, and just doing, you know, or… And certainly peptides are drugs. Like, just your, your start- For sure … you know, if you get kind of dialed in with just a handful of like, with, with the testosterone, you get that, that changes a lot.
[50:19] Bryan Krahn: You get that dialed in, you’re gonna, you’re gonna notice that. So I mean, yeah, there’s things you can add to that, but it’s much better just to be conservative and just, you know, get these base- get these fundamentals in. And that includes, obviously that includes like your diet and your exercise- Mm-hmm
[50:35] Bryan Krahn: and your rest. You know, get those dialed in, then, you know, look at the, the really important, you know, pharmacology like that you can add. And then, okay, what other esoterics can I add? But you probably don’t have to go that far. You know? You-
[50:49] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah. And even with TRT, like we’ve got pretty good knowledge of just straight up growth hormone and testosterone.
[50:55] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah. If you wanna find- It’s great … a physician and, and go that route, like-
[50:59] Bryan Krahn: Yeah …
[50:59] Dr. Mike T Nelson: we’ve got a lot of data to say, “Here’s the upsides. Here’s the things to watch out for. Here’s the potential downsides.” Mm-hmm. Have an intelligent, educated conversation with your physician. Ask him- Yeah … you, if you want to ever go off in the future, is that an option, et cetera.
[51:14] Dr. Mike T Nelson: And then, you know- Yeah … I don’t use any TRT per se. I’m not against it, but w- I feel comfortable recommending someone to an actual physician who’s gonna have a real conversation with them, because we actually- Mm-hmm … have data on that, and I feel like someone could make a, an educated decision. Where, “Oh, I wanna try these eight peptides.”
[51:34] Dr. Mike T Nelson: F- I don’t even know if those peptides are real. You know? Much less- Well, yeah … what do they do?
[51:41] Bryan Krahn: Yeah, I, it’s, yeah, I, I would never say, like, I’m, I’m a big fan of TRT, but I, I would never say, yeah, it’s, it’s everyone should go on it. I think that’s, that’s really irresponsible or, um… But I will say, man, it’s like if you need it, especially mentally, you know, if you, if you- Mm-hmm
[51:59] Bryan Krahn: if you need it and you address it, your life changes. Like, and that sounds very dramatic and salesman-like. Yeah, yeah. It, uh, it does. Like you address- I mean, I’ve heard that
[52:07] Dr. Mike T Nelson: from clients in the past too.
[52:09] Bryan Krahn: Yeah. Now, if you’re 24 or even, even if you’re just looking to get jacked, you’re gonna be really disappointed.
[52:16] Bryan Krahn: Like-
[52:16] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah …
[52:17] Bryan Krahn: like, what about- That’s what we have TRT
[52:18] Dr. Mike T Nelson: plus, bro.
[52:19] Bryan Krahn: Well, yeah. Well, and that’s… Yeah, I’ve, I’ve had those. That works, that works too. But it’s- Yeah … now you’re, there go those safety parameters.
[52:28] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah.
[52:28] Bryan Krahn: Um, but- HDL
[52:30] Dr. Mike T Nelson: seven. It’s okay.
[52:33] Bryan Krahn: Uh, just do some, just do some HIIT, bro.
[52:35] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah, yeah. More cardio.
[52:37] Bryan Krahn: Yeah. Although, yeah, interesting.
[52:40] Bryan Krahn: Um, I mean, there’s all these things that you can do to, to modulate that lab- ’cause that’s a big… When you get your, as a TRT guy, when you get your labs-
[52:49] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Mm-hmm …
[52:49] Bryan Krahn: you know, you’re always kinda like, “Okay, I gotta get my HDL tested.” You’re always kinda worrying. Um, and so you might subconsciously or consciously, “Oh, I’ll take some citrus bergamots, and I’ll take some, uh-
[52:59] Bryan Krahn: I’ll take some niacin. I’ll take, uh, I’ll start doing a lot of HIIT. I wanna bring that HDL up.” But apparently there’s no- Uh, there’s no correlation to longevity and increased health outcomes if you increase your HDL via supplementation. Really? It’s o- yeah. Interesting. It’s only… Yeah, I, I’ve heard that from a few s- sources, and- Huh
[53:20] Bryan Krahn: it’s, it’s only when you’ve increased it via, like, doing lots of HIIT cardio. Wow. And same thing with LDL. If you reduce your LDL via, I’m not sure about fish oil, but if you reduce it via, uh, what, what lowers, like- Statin … uh, statin will do, statins. Um, it’s, it’s not, it’s not as predictive as versus you lowering it with, you know, dietary- Yeah
[53:43] Bryan Krahn: and obviously exercise. Yeah. So it’s, that’s, that’s apparently- That might
[53:47] Dr. Mike T Nelson: be true too. Yeah. Especially looking at doses of statins. I think the, the vessel- Mm-hmm … anti-inflammatory dose of a statin is, like, ungodly small compared to, you know, so on a very small dose- Mm … you’re getting supposedly the- Yeah
[54:00] Dr. Mike T Nelson: large benefit and that the side effect is the, the lowering of the HDL- Yeah … which just ends up then being the marker for it and everything else, but.
[54:10] Bryan Krahn: Yeah, and, and to be fair, I might be talking out of school. I know it applied to the HDL.
[54:14] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Hmm.
[54:15] Bryan Krahn: Interesting. But als- but als- but also applies to PSA, ’cause that’s one I used to always worry about.
[54:19] Bryan Krahn: Oh. ’Cause that’s in my family is very high PSAs. So when I have labs coming up, I’d always be like, “Okay.” You know, start taking my prostate formulas, you know, the saw palmetto and lycopene and, um, well, there’s a bunch of things you can take to lower the PSA. As well as, uh, you know, don’t have an orgasm a few days prior or if, you know, to your test.
[54:42] Bryan Krahn: Don’t even ride a bike. Really? A bike ri- ’Cause they all affect- Oh, wow. The pressure? Yeah, ’cause these, yeah, yeah, these are all things that can affect the PSA. Huh. But as Dr. Brant pointed out once, Dr. Jordan Brant, he’s a, uh, one of those silver back presenters I really like. Mm-hmm. Uh, just lowering the PSA, that’s what…
[55:00] Bryan Krahn: You do all these things then to lower the PSA, but you’re not really addressing whether there’s prostate. Like, you’re not, you know what I mean? Yeah. It’s, it has, it’s not addressing prostate cancer. They’re kinda like cramming for the test. You’re, you’re, yeah, you’re hammering the marker. But the marker doesn’t necessarily indicate that there’s a cancer, you know?
[55:18] Bryan Krahn: So it’s kinda like you’re, you’re almost like you’re fooling yourself.
[55:22] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah.
[55:23] Bryan Krahn: So I thought that was kind of a, an interesting perspective. But, you know, I’ve got labs coming up. I’m taking, I’m taking off the prostate formula, you know? Yeah. Get off of a bike.
[55:32] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah. I kinda do the more Dan Gardner approach-
[55:35] Dr. Mike T Nelson: where if possible, and for myself, like I’ll try to not take much of anything for one to two weeks before. Yeah. Because if something is off, that is like the worst-case scenario, and I would wanna know about it versus trying to mask something.
[55:50] Bryan Krahn: Yeah.
[55:52] Dr. Mike T Nelson: I don’t know. Well- It’s like the opposite approach.
[55:54] Bryan Krahn: Well, that was…
[55:55] Bryan Krahn: I, I know Dan. I used to trade Dan. I love Dan.
[55:57] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah, I know.
[55:59] Bryan Krahn: Um, but that’s the thing is, though, that’s, that’s from a health approach. Now you’re trying to-
[56:04] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Oh, of course it is. Yeah …
[56:05] Bryan Krahn: but if you’re trying to have your numbers down so you get your script approved, so you have to look- Right,
[56:10] Dr. Mike T Nelson: different- … a different dude
[56:10] Dr. Mike T Nelson: different animal. Yeah.
[56:13] Bryan Krahn: You’re not trying to-
[56:15] Dr. Mike T Nelson: I’m pointing out the inverse case here.
[56:18] Bryan Krahn: I’m trying to sandbag my testosterone levels so my doctor redoes my script, you know? So-
[56:23] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah. And people have done that for years, right? Just stay up the whole night. Oh, fuck yeah. Use a bunch of stimulants. Don’t sleep.
[56:27] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah. You know, lower your calories, you know, all that kinda stuff. Like, “Oh my God, my testosterone’s low.”
[56:34] Bryan Krahn: Somebody tell that to your Secretary of War.
[56:37] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Oh, yeah. Oh, God. I think that… Did they actually change that now? They took it back, or I- I don’t know. You know- On one hand, I’m like, “Okay, good. Th- this could-
[56:50] Dr. Mike T Nelson: could be good.” But knowing how the government does stuff, it’s… You can almost guarantee it would be a complete disaster. It’s like it would be much better if you just said, “Hey, how about we actually fund Veterans Affairs? How about we actually- Yeah. Well- … give people in the military, uh, food when they’re on an aircraft carrier for nine months on end?”
[57:10] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Like, there’s a whole bunch of low-hanging fruit- Yeah … I’m sure you could do that would improve a ton of things before coming out and being like, “Ah, they need T. We’re gonna give ’em T.” I’m like, “Oh, God.”
[57:20] Bryan Krahn: I know. It’s, it’s, it’s one of those things that as soon as it made the n- the news, you know, and I saw it, I’m like, “Oh, God, there’s gonna be, there’s just gonna be terrible takes from both sides.”
[57:30] Bryan Krahn: Of course. That’s why you don’t ever see any, like, guys who take a lot of testosterone or know a lot about it weigh in ’cause they’re like, “I don’t even wanna be a part of this.” You know? I just don’t. No, it’s
[57:39] Dr. Mike T Nelson: just a disaster on both sides. Because again, and, and you’ve seen this too. Yeah. Like, I’ve seen the people I’ve worked with who had a lot of blast trauma, and because of changes- Yeah
[57:49] Dr. Mike T Nelson: in their brain, like, th- that- Yeah … their doctor did everything possible with them, no output of testosterone at all. So yeah, okay, in that case, like, you, TRT is probably gonna be a really good thing for you. Mm-hmm. You know? Yeah. But again, that takes a lot of testing to figure out, and more blood work, and a bunch of other stuff.
[58:05] Dr. Mike T Nelson: It’s not as simple as, “I don’t know. Let’s just do a single point.” Especially in non-symptomatic people of low testosterone. Yeah. It’s like almost every physician would be like, “That’s a horrible thing to just even try to do.” There’s much better ways to go about doing this.
[58:21] Bryan Krahn: Oh, man. Some of them see th- yeah.
[58:22] Bryan Krahn: It’s obviously TR- yeah. Obviously TRT could help.
[58:27] Dr. Mike T Nelson: For
[58:27] Bryan Krahn: sure. But that, but that’s probably gonna need a multifaceted approach there to get that person some help. I mean, to focus on that is kind of silly.
[58:36] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah. And then I also think about- Mm-hmm … you know, even I’ve known other people who have traveled who are on TRT and have been gone for long periods of time, and shocker, uh, you can’t bring steroids into a lot of other countries.
[58:51] Dr. Mike T Nelson: You know, and so that- Okay … presented some issues for a few people who legally had a script and were, were 100% legit in the US. It’s like, ooh. Ooh, yeah.
[59:01] Bryan Krahn: Well, this ju- this just happened to me. I was, I was going to New York and, uh, o- of course went through customs and I, and my secur- or what’s the, what’s the border agent in the US?
[59:11] Bryan Krahn: I guess it’s border security. What security you guys- Border Security probably. Yeah. Yeah, whatever, whatever the acronym is. Big dude. Border Patrol. Yeah, Border Patrol, and he’s b- he’s screening me. He’s like big dude. He’s like, “Where you going?” I’m like, “I’m going to New York City,” you know. “Where are you, what, what for?”
[59:23] Bryan Krahn: And I’m like, “I’m going to Men’s Health,” and he said, “Oh yeah, what are you doing there?” I’m like, “Oh, I’m going on their podcast. I’m attending…” And then he’s like, “You bringing any steroid, bringing any steroids with you?” And I’m like, I’m like, “No.” And he’s like, “No TRT?” And I’m like, “No, no.” And I said, “I, I don’t, nope.”
[59:39] Bryan Krahn: And he’s like, “What’s your dose?” And I’m like, “Uh, it’s, uh, .75 milligrams,” I go, “bi-weekly.” And I, I misspoke. Uh, not deliberately, I was nervous. And he goes, “That’s a little low.” And I’m like, and I’m like, “Oh, I meant twice a week.” He goes, “Oh yeah, okay.” And then j- I’m through and I’m, I’m walking away, I’m going, “What the fuck just happened?”
[1:00:02] Bryan Krahn: You know- Those are
[1:00:02] Dr. Mike T Nelson: pretty specific questions …
[1:00:04] Bryan Krahn: Well, I’m just like, I was like, “When, what?” You know. And he’s, which is right. I was like, “Okay.” I guess his job is so boring. Is he a bro? So when he says, “Seasons-” Yeah … you know, I’m kind of bro, he’s like, “Oh, here’s my chance to have some conversation,” you know?
[1:00:17] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah, and I was also thinking, I’m like, oh, if you said daily, he’d be like, “Ah, get over here for the screening,” or something,
[1:00:23] Bryan Krahn: you know?
[1:00:24] Bryan Krahn: Oh, yeah, yeah. No, no, but that’s, that’s, again, that’s a very good point. I mean, you gotta… Yeah, people who go into s- countries without knowing the, just, you know, you, you can go off for a long time. It’s not that bad. If you’ll-
[1:00:37] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah, especially if you know coming up, right? Yes. If you know I’ve got a big trip to a crazy country- Yeah
[1:00:42] Dr. Mike T Nelson: that’s super strict and it’s six months from now, y- you know, talk to your doctor. There’s probably some prep you wa- you wanna do if you’re gonna be there for a few months.
[1:00:50] Bryan Krahn: Yeah, like God, I’ve gone off for literally years and it’s, it, yeah, it’s not that bad. You know? And it’s, life… And yes, it does come back for most people.
[1:01:01] Bryan Krahn: It’s- Mm-hmm … it’s just life’s better on. Uh, what’s, if you need to be on, life’s better on. So.
[1:01:06] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah.
[1:01:07] Bryan Krahn: Yeah. Um- But if you can go in for your three-week trip without a shot, you’ll be, you’ll be okay.
[1:01:11] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah, yeah. Um, how’s the cardio going?
[1:01:15] Bryan Krahn: Oh, I knew you were gonna bring that up.
[1:01:17] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Uh.
[1:01:19] Bryan Krahn: Yeah, I know, I just… See, I wanna be, I wanna bring it up.
[1:01:24] Bryan Krahn: And, uh, I like, I like your pr- your plan that you put out, ’cause they’re like six-minute sessions and I’m actually- Oh, thank you.
[1:01:29] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah. That’s been going
[1:01:30] Bryan Krahn: all right. Well, I’ve just started do- ’cause I’m, you know me, I’m, I’m a lifter first, so I’m always like- Yeah, yeah … so I’m trying to squeeze them in in the morning, and I’m just- Yeah, perfect
[1:01:39] Bryan Krahn: that r- yeah, right now I got my, get my kid in routine, just going to school, so I, I’ve been skipping them. But, um, that’s my plan, is to do that four days a week, to do, um, either a race to 1,000 meter or 2,000 meters or that 2-2-2 plan that you got So, or is that the way I should be doing it?
[1:01:58] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah, I mean, I would do a baseline 2K, right?
[1:02:00] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah. That’s gonna give you, one, your time, and also you can convert that to a VO2 max. So population-wise you can kinda know where you land. And then the simplest one is just a six-minute progressive, and then if you can fit in one higher intensity interval day per week, that’s pretty beneficial. And that interval then on the rower, so if you’re, say, simple math, right?
[1:02:27] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Let’s say your 2K time is eight minutes. So eight minutes is 200 watts. Okay. By definition, 200 watts is your VO2 max. So your interval work you would wanna do at your VO2 max. But you would do it sub-test. So if your test took eight minutes, I would target probably six minutes and see if you can hold an average of 200 watts.
[1:02:49] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Rest completely, and then see if you can add another interval. So you’re gonna wanna work up to- Ooh … probably 12 to 18 minutes total time of intervals over, you know, four to eight weeks. And I allow people to rest completely between it. So if you all of a sudden hit, like, “Man, I went as hard as I could on interval three ’cause I thought I could pull it off,” and your average watts are, like, 175, you’re definitely done for that day, and you probably would go back a little bit before you would get to three again.
[1:03:20] Dr. Mike T Nelson: ’Cause you wanna hold that output, and the output then gives you your marker and order to progress. Just like lifting, right? Yeah, yeah. If you’re lifting with a, a rep range of six to eight, “Oh man, I can do nine reps now. Oh great, now it’s time to stay in that rep range if we want, but let’s add the weight.
[1:03:34] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Oh okay, now I’m back down to six minute, you know, six reps again.” It’s the same idea that you- Okay … you need that fixed output, that high output, and then over time you’re gonna try to do more intervals or over time a, a longer interval. You know, run that for eight to 12 weeks, take, you know, a week off or just do light stuff for cardio, and then retest your 2K.
[1:03:56] Bryan Krahn: And the total number of sessions per week then would be, so you said one, one sh- longer interval?
[1:04:03] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yep, so one what they call VO2 max interval. Yeah. So that’d be one day, and that’s usually probably- Mm-hmm … a day on its own ’cause it’s, it’s pretty intense. And then you
[1:04:12] Bryan Krahn: can- Would that, that’s like, would that be like your version of the four by four?
[1:04:15] Bryan Krahn: Like I, I read that too.
[1:04:16] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah. The four- So my version of the four by four is this, it’s the exact same idea, but the problem I kept running into is people are like, “But you didn’t tell me w- exactly what to do.” Oh, yeah. And the reason I think they like the four by four is they’re like, “Ah, light my nut sack on fire for four minutes and just do it for four rounds.”
[1:04:34] Dr. Mike T Nelson: I’m like, “Okay.” Well, yeah, yeah. The people who sent that to me, I’m like- You can’t do four rounds right away at four minutes at a high output. And the people who had- No … enough gonadal fortitude to complete all 16 minutes, their output started here and just fucking tanked. Yeah. And so you’re just- For a rest
[1:04:50] Bryan Krahn: of a long time
[1:04:51] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah. And all you’re doing then is just, you know, hitting your dick into the dirt the whole time and impairing your recovery. Like, you’re not getting the adaptation- Yeah … you think if you’re doing it at 125 watts when your VO2 max is 200 watts, right? You’re doing something- Yeah … completely different, which is fine if that was your goal.
[1:05:09] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Um, so what I did with that one is I said, “Okay, people love the four-by-four approach. Do four minutes. Great. Fine. But you’re gonna do it based on your output, as hard of output as you can hold on average for those four minutes. Rest completely, and then see if you can do another one within 5 to 10% of that output,” because the original study used heart rate.
[1:05:31] Dr. Mike T Nelson: And the, the thing you can run into with heart rate is you could have an extremely high heart rate for round two, but that be at an output of 130 watts. And so now you’re, you’re training something different that’s not gonna transfer as well. Like in lifting, we would call it like the junk reps type thing, which you can argue if that’s a thing or not.
[1:05:50] Dr. Mike T Nelson: It’s just more work that doesn’t transfer- Yeah … to your goals. And that was a problem I kept seeing people run into, and then it annoyed me because- As much as I love all my research friends, it was mostly, you know, air quote, “top researcher” who said, “Do this thing.” And I’m like, if you’ve ever coached anyone, you would realize right away that this is a horrible idea.
[1:06:11] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Like, can elite level athletes- Yeah … who are very good monitoring output and stuff get away with it and the people in the study? Yes. Can the average meathead who hasn’t done cardio since Reagan was in president, like, pull off a four- … by four at a high output? Hell no. And the people- Yeah … who are hardcore enough to do it will force themselves to do it at that high heart rate, but their output is just dog shit after, like, minute six of, you know, their second round halfway through, they’re just kkh- you know- Yeah
[1:06:38] Dr. Mike T Nelson: all the way off. So that was my pet peeve with that.
[1:06:42] Bryan Krahn: Okay. And you, but you are a big fan of using the rower exclusively for all this, right?
[1:06:47] Dr. Mike T Nelson: I like using the rower because… And you can use an AssaultBike too. The AssaultBike is absolutely brutal. Mostly concentric, not a lot of eccentric, all that kind of stuff.
[1:06:55] Bryan Krahn: Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yep.
[1:06:56] Dr. Mike T Nelson: The, the reason I like the rower is because it’s just so much easier to, to standardize, and the AssaultBikes, the, the output between the two, radically different, not even in the same universe, right? Because they’re from different companies. Was it the AssaultBike versus the Echo Bike?
[1:07:13] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Um, and there’s just no, I can’t find any good standardized data on them. Mm-hmm. Where Concept2 is actually standardized. It’s been used in CrossFit competitions. It’s used in- Yeah, yeah … HYROX. You can take one rower and compare it to another rower and they’re, they’re very, very close. Mm-hmm. And then we have all the metrics.
[1:07:31] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Like you can go into the logbook, you can see where everybody’s at. I can monitor their logbook remotely. I can see their pace. I can see everything- Wow … and their whole output the entire time. And most people want transfer, right? So they, I think having that upper body pulling component with the lower body just tends to transfer more to everyday life, to their sport, to whatever they’re doing, and also it’s mostly concentric.
[1:07:56] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Like y- there’s not- Yeah … a lot of eccentric load. There’s no impact. Yes, there’s form- Yeah … issues, but most people can get- Yeah … good enough form that- Yeah … you’re gonna get a training effect. Like you’re not training to be an Olympic level rower where every- Yeah … little form thing matters. Yeah. Even if your form is kind of bad, you still get an aerobic training effect, right?
[1:08:16] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Like y- you could argue injury risk maybe goes up a little bit with the low back and the hip flexors, et cetera. But anyway, I feel like I should-
[1:08:23] Bryan Krahn: Yeah …
[1:08:23] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Concept2 should sponsor me at some point, but they- Yeah … don’t send me any money.
[1:08:27] Bryan Krahn: Okay. So the one long session a week, the one modified four by four, and then what- Yep
[1:08:31] Bryan Krahn: two to three of the, or two
[1:08:33] Dr. Mike T Nelson: to three short ones? Um, I’ve had people go up to… What I actually in a perfect world would have people do the progressive six-minute like five times a week. Oh. So they would do it five times a week, and they would do the high output interval, and then one day would be completely off.
[1:08:47] Bryan Krahn: Okay.
[1:08:49] Dr. Mike T Nelson: That, I mean, that would be-
[1:08:49] Bryan Krahn: Yeah …
[1:08:50] Dr. Mike T Nelson: that would be ideal.
[1:08:51] Bryan Krahn: Yeah.
[1:08:51] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Um-
[1:08:52] Bryan Krahn: Yeah …
[1:08:52] Dr. Mike T Nelson: and then the s- the six-minute one, you can modify your RP on it. If y- you’ve, you’re starting to feel a little bit cooked after a couple weeks, just-
[1:09:01] Bryan Krahn: Yep …
[1:09:02] Dr. Mike T Nelson: drop the intensity down a little bit. Like one thing I’ve noticed over the years with aerobic stuff is there’s, the research is not super clear on this, but it just feels like frequency, especially when you’re older, makes just a massive difference.
[1:09:17] Dr. Mike T Nelson: I don’t know. That’s just one thing I’ve noticed over time on it. So I’m a big fan of, you know, moderate stuff most of the time, high frequency. Yep, on your interval day by all means, you know, hammer it hard. On your interval day you get that high output session, and then just go back to something more moderate again
[1:09:35] Bryan Krahn: Very cool.
[1:09:36] Bryan Krahn: Well, I’m starting, I promise. I got-
[1:09:39] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah.
[1:09:39] Bryan Krahn: Nice … got my ro- my rower’s all tuned up. Uh, I’ve, I’ve… I’ll make the time.
[1:09:45] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah. And what I found with people- Yeah … who do cognitive stuff, like d- having it done in the morning, I just feel cognitively so much better for the next, like- Oh, yeah … two to three hours. And so that’s why I like also separating it is, even if my performance wasn’t the greatest, I still got something in, and then my lifting can be it’s lifting alone.
[1:10:05] Dr. Mike T Nelson: You know, I-
[1:10:06] Bryan Krahn: Yep …
[1:10:06] Dr. Mike T Nelson: the Meta Cardio, we’ve got, you know, you can do some aerobic stuff before lifting or after lifting, and there’s multiple different programs. But, you know, the easiest one is just progressive six-minute one day of intervals and, you know, people can get pretty far just doing that.
[1:10:22] Bryan Krahn: Yep. Yep.
[1:10:23] Bryan Krahn: Yeah, that’s, um, interesting, and as I get older, that’s a lot more important to me. Not as- Yeah … never as important as lifting. That’s-
[1:10:30] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah, yeah.
[1:10:31] Bryan Krahn: Never. All right.
[1:10:36] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Cool. Anything else as we wrap up?
[1:10:38] Bryan Krahn: No, man, that’s, that’s it, that’s it for me. Still, still me, still coaching, so.
[1:10:44] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Awesome. My last question- Yeah … for you is should people disclose AI when they’re writing?
[1:10:50] Dr. Mike T Nelson: ’Cause you’ve done a lot of fitness writing- Uh-huh … and I know we talked about AI disclosure with clients and everything else.
[1:10:56] Bryan Krahn: Yeah. ’
[1:10:57] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Cause I’ve had a few places now that, and I understand their policy is we don’t want any AI at all in it because it’s, it’s a magazine, and I was on a call with them and I’m like, “I already wrote this, and I used AI to synthesize some of the research.”
[1:11:12] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah. And then I did put it in AI to say, “Hey, you know, give me feedback on this article as if you were one of their population people.” Yeah. Like, what part was I clear? What part was I not clear? And so it was useful for some of that feedback, but my fear is now it’s gonna read as it’s all AI maybe because it was entered in AI.
[1:11:32] Dr. Mike T Nelson: And, and I get their thing that, like, they don’t want any AI because it’s a magazine and things like that, but I don’t know. I’m just curious on your opinion.
[1:11:41] Bryan Krahn: That’s a really, should they disclose? Well, here’s the thing. Everybody in school who’s training to do those jobs is using AI to do their writing anyway.
[1:11:51] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Of course they are.
[1:11:53] Bryan Krahn: You know? So it’s, it’s one of those… I don’t know. I think, uh, a- as a… I’m not so much of a writer anymore, just purely out of time.
[1:12:02] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah.
[1:12:02] Bryan Krahn: Um, but I’ve done- But you wrote for many years. Oh, yeah, yeah. For a lot of publications. It’s, it’s probably what I’ll go back to one day. But, um, uh, I think it’s going to be such an integral part of what we do that I think the…
[1:12:16] Bryan Krahn: it’ll just be a given that it was involved- Mm-hmm … in the creation of, of every original piece of work. Yeah. And it only ma- it only makes sense. Like, why… Just like in my coaching, like why wouldn’t I use AI to compile all my data, client data, to do something in half a second that would take me freaking hours to do?
[1:12:35] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Mm-hmm.
[1:12:35] Bryan Krahn: You know? When it… You know, it’s like, why… It’s, it’s frankly it’d be stupid not to. You know? Like, so if you’re… Especially when you’re doing, like, a research piece. It’s not like we’re talking literature here, you know?
[1:12:46] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah, we’re not like wr- w- writing a fiction story or something.
[1:12:48] Bryan Krahn: Yeah, yeah. It’s, you know, it’s for- Or even a-
[1:12:50] Bryan Krahn: for publication, but
[1:12:51] Dr. Mike T Nelson: it’s a more technical piece.
[1:12:52] Bryan Krahn: Yeah, or even a freaking book report. Like, we’re talking, yeah, a technical piece. Why wouldn’t you use AI to, to do those very, you know, those very calc- the calculations and stuff? Like, the very dry tasks like that, that you’d simply be using a calculator for anyway.
[1:13:08] Bryan Krahn: Like, why wouldn’t you- Yeah … use the tools? Um, so I think it’s… I think over time it’s just going to be given that… You know, this time I, I, and I think w- when, when we screw up, we’ll be like, “Oh, yeah, that was one, that was an AI error.” You
[1:13:22] Dr. Mike T Nelson: know? Yeah.
[1:13:25] Bryan Krahn: Yeah. So- The
[1:13:26] Dr. Mike T Nelson: bot got me.
[1:13:27] Bryan Krahn: Yeah. The, yeah, it’s like, “Oh, no, that was the…”
[1:13:28] Bryan Krahn: Yeah. So, no, I don’t… Not that I’m in any position to know, but I don’t f- I don’t think that’s, that’s… Unless it’s creative, purely creative work. That’s, that’s different, you know? Yeah. Or you’re in school.
[1:13:42] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah. Yeah. And I, I’ve… I mean, that was the first thing that got me. M- you know, our buddy Dean Guido years ago was like, “Hey, man, you need to check out this AI thing.”
[1:13:50] Dr. Mike T Nelson: I was like, “Yeah, what are you talking about?” He’s like, “Go put a question you would give one of your students in the past in there and tell it to write an essay on it, and don’t give it anything else.” Mm-hmm. This is probably two and a half years ago. Yeah. And I’m like, “All right. I’m down for a good experiment.”
[1:14:04] Dr. Mike T Nelson: So I download ChatGPT, you know, grabbed an old question, put it in there. And again, this is two and a half years ago, and I read it and I was like- holy shit Oh, yeah This is pretty good. Like, it made a lot of technical errors at that point, and references were completely made up, and there’s a lot of hallucinations in it.
[1:14:21] Dr. Mike T Nelson: But if I was not a subject matter expert in that area- Mm-hmm … for a technical- Mm-hmm … writing piece, at that point I would’ve given it a B. Like, you know, if I throw out that it’s not technically accurate, if we assume that problem gets solved- Yeah … and then I was like, “Holy crap, and this is the worst it’s ever gonna be.”
[1:14:39] Dr. Mike T Nelson: It’s like, “Ah, shit, I should probably pay attention to this thing.”
[1:14:42] Bryan Krahn: I know. I know. Paul, Paul Thiel turned me… He, ’cause he used to work at YouTube and, and- Mm … Google. He used to work for me for a bit too. I miss him. Um, but he was, he was early into ChatGPT, and he’s like, he’s like, I, he showed me what he asked it.
[1:14:57] Bryan Krahn: He said, “Oh, write an article, a fitness article, blah, blah, blah, and make it sound like Brian Kron.” Mm. And then he sent me the results, and it was like, it, it- used kind of short, kind of terse sentences. It was kind of- Yeah … sarcastic, some bad jokes. I’m like, this is fucking me, you know? Like it’s- Yeah. You know, you know, I could have made it better, but if, if I was in a rush, man, like, you know, it…
[1:15:20] Bryan Krahn: What it did in pure honest, and what it did do perfectly was it, it solved the problem that frankly keeps me from writing, and it solved the blank page.
[1:15:30] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Mm.
[1:15:30] Bryan Krahn: Yes. And it’s like, you know, you know, so it, it… I would write more even how, with how busy I am with clients and being a dad, I would write more if I didn’t always have the blank page.
[1:15:39] Bryan Krahn: Mm-hmm. Just like, “Okay, like where do I fucking start here?” You know, like it solves that. So like, wow, I’ve got like a so-so article here. Now I just gotta edit it. Done that a lot, you know?
[1:15:49] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah, yeah.
[1:15:50] Bryan Krahn: Like, you know, I just gotta make this kinda crappy car better. Like that’s so much, so much more fun.
[1:15:56] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Mm-hmm.
[1:15:57] Bryan Krahn: Um, so that’s, mm, it’s pretty cool that way.
[1:16:01] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah. And the only way it was able to do that in your voice is because you paradoxically written a ton of stuff from scratch without the use of AI. Yeah. So it actually had something to pull in within your voice to make it sound like you. Where I think my fear is with people who are new is they’ve never written anything.
[1:16:19] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah. So there’s nothing for them to, to pull from. They have no style. They have no… There’s nothing to their voice because it’s just- Yeah … it’s not developed yet, and they tell AI to write something, and it’s just gonna be this mediocre like blah, who gives a shit?
[1:16:35] Bryan Krahn: Yeah. Yeah, exactly. But it’s gonna replace us eventually, man.
[1:16:41] Dr. Mike T Nelson: I know. The writing thing, I don’t, I, I keep trying, and I keep at trying to educate my little AI thing because my-
[1:16:50] Bryan Krahn: Mm …
[1:16:50] Dr. Mike T Nelson: my fear for a while was could I ever get… If something happens to me and I can’t write ’cause my whole business is newsletter based, I’m, I’m kind of screwed.
[1:16:57] Bryan Krahn: Yeah.
[1:16:57] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah. So like as a backup, could I get this to be good enough where I would read it and it would pass as me?
[1:17:05] Dr. Mike T Nelson: And so I’ve spent- Yeah … way too many hours, put it in all articles, all the stuff I’ve ever written, and it, you know, some days it’s, it’s okay, but there’s still just something about it that’s just-
[1:17:15] Bryan Krahn: Yeah …
[1:17:16] Dr. Mike T Nelson: off enough. Yeah. I can’t-
[1:17:18] Bryan Krahn: Mm …
[1:17:18] Dr. Mike T Nelson: figure it out. And the handful of times I force myself to use it and to edit it, I just get pissed off at it, and I just go back to writing from scratch again.
[1:17:28] Dr. Mike T Nelson: But that’s where all my reps are at too, you know? ’Cause I spent-
[1:17:31] Bryan Krahn: Yeah …
[1:17:31] Dr. Mike T Nelson: tens of how many years- Mm … and thousands of articles writing shit from scratch.
[1:17:36] Bryan Krahn: Yeah. Well, exactly. It sounds like an impression. Like, it’s like someone doing a Donald Trump impression.
[1:17:41] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Right,
[1:17:41] Bryan Krahn: right. You know? Yeah. You know, they get the hands and they get- Yeah.
[1:17:44] Bryan Krahn: you know, the, you know, and the, and the nuances, ah. You know, but it’s like- … it’s not, it’s, it’s clearly an impression, you know? Right. And it’s just, you know. So yeah. Yeah. I know it’s, you’ve inspired me. I’m gonna start using AI to help- … kickstart my new, get my newsletter going again.
[1:18:02] Dr. Mike T Nelson: It, it is helpful though.
[1:18:03] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Like sometimes- Yeah … I’ve just put topics in, and even if it’s something I completely disagree with- Yeah … I’m like, but at least it’s something to, to start with when you just get- Yeah, mm-hmm … really stuck. And by the end of it, like almost, almost none of it is actually what was even in there before. Yeah.
[1:18:20] Dr. Mike T Nelson: But it’s just sometimes just getting the process going.
[1:18:24] Bryan Krahn: Yeah, so I think that’s probably sums it up just as a whole. Like, if we can keep it to a really helpful assistant- Mm-hmm … even a, dare I say, very proactive assistant, you know, like, it’s great, but as soon as you turn over the keys and say, “Hey, you know, whether it’s, you know, you know, running nuclear submarines or just-”
[1:18:44] Bryan Krahn: doing something, if you just give it, like, full command, I think you’re in- you’re asking for trouble.
[1:18:50] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah. Awesome. Well, thank you so much.
[1:18:53] Bryan Krahn: Yeah. I appreciate it. Yeah.
[1:18:54] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Uh, anything new coming up for you, future projects, anything like that?
[1:18:58] Bryan Krahn: No, no, just, uh, just still just full-on coaching. I got some, uh, spots that are available.
[1:19:05] Bryan Krahn: Oh, okay. I’m actually, I’m actually pretty full, but I do have- I’m actually pretty full, but I could probably take on three or four. Uh, but no, I’m, uh, in terms of personally, no, I’m just, uh, gonna work on my cardio this, this off-season and, and try to gain a little bit of muscle, but I’m 53, that’s kinda limited.
[1:19:25] Bryan Krahn: But I don’t know. We’ll see. I had a f- I’ve had a really good, had a really good 50 to 53, much better than my 40s. We can talk about that sometimes. Oh, nice. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Yeah, so gained more muscle from 50 to 53 than I did 40 to 50. Wow. And it was just by just kinda working with my body in different ways and so I’m sharing that now with my clients.
[1:19:46] Bryan Krahn: So- Yeah, that’s cool … if you’re in, if you’re in that age group, come on, come on down. Yeah. Uh, but no, it’s, to be perfectly serious, it’s really made me love training again, so it’s, yeah. Yeah. That’s what I’m doing. Yeah.
[1:20:00] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah. I did something similar, although I’ve gained a lot more body fat in the process, but that wasn’t my goal- Yeah.
[1:20:05] Dr. Mike T Nelson: it was just more consistently doing more hypertrophy, having- Yeah … more of a caloric surplus consistently for just longer periods of time. And if I go by, like, body impedance, it, you know, over a year I gain, you know, like five to seven pounds of lean body mass. Yeah. Now, I gain probably eight to 10 pounds of fat with that.
[1:20:27] Bryan Krahn: Yeah.
[1:20:27] Dr. Mike T Nelson: But you can always pull that back, too. Or, you know, I’m- Yeah … you know, I just turned 52, you know, where I think- Oh, you did? Yeah … a lot of people on the internet would be like- Yeah … “Well, that’s not possible,” or, you know, without even using peptides or anything else. Yeah. And I’m like-
[1:20:39] Bryan Krahn: Yeah …
[1:20:39] Dr. Mike T Nelson: I, I just think there’s a lot more, like you said, there’s a lot more runway there that people can do when they’re doing things that are consistent, and they are the right things to do at that time.
[1:20:48] Bryan Krahn: Yeah, and just, just not getting injured
[1:20:52] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Oh, don’t get injured. And, uh- Yes,
[1:20:53] Bryan Krahn: don’t- That
[1:20:54] Dr. Mike T Nelson: is, like, the biggest thing that’ll screw up everything.
[1:20:56] Bryan Krahn: Yeah. I, I just gave the secret away, man. Just don’t get injured. Find those exercises you can load, and, and just stick with them, and, and yeah, all of a sudden… And yeah, don’t let your weight get too high.
[1:21:09] Bryan Krahn: Don’t… You know, just let, let everything kind of cruise.
[1:21:11] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Mm-hmm.
[1:21:12] Bryan Krahn: You know? And, uh, and then when in doubt, use Arnold’s advice. Just change the diet, up the dosage.
[1:21:19] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Yeah. You know what I mean? Cool. Where can people find you, sir?
[1:21:24] Bryan Krahn: Uh, you can find me on Instagram at @bryankrahn, B-R-Y-A-N-K-R-A-H-N, and my website’s over50muscle.com.
[1:21:33] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Nice. Awesome.
[1:21:34] Bryan Krahn: Yeah. All right.
[1:21:35] Dr. Mike T Nelson: Thank you, sir. Appreciate it.
[1:21:37] Bryan Krahn: You bet, man. Thank you.